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July 9, 2013

The Power of Attorney was rejected by a bank

Filed under: Power of Attorney — Tags: , , , , , — admin @ 8:46 am

I was reminded of this situation as I looked through our retweets. Apparantly, our followers like tweets about Powers of Attorney. So, I decided to come up with some real stories about Power of Attorney signings that can inform and inspire notaries everywhere.

It happened many years ago. I remember many of the details. I went to someone’s home to notarize a Power of Attorney for banking. They had a fancy Attorney draw up the document and it looked very professional. Please note: non-Attorney notaries are probably NOT ALLOWED to draft up Power of Attorney documents or other legal documents in most if not all states. I had notarized many types of Power of Attorney documents in the past. Durable Powers of Attorney, Health Care Powers of Attorney, Living Wills, Limited Powers of Attorney, Correction Agreement Power of Attorney, and many others too. Yes, a Living Will is a form of Power of Attorney where it gives someone authority to make medical and other decisions for the principal should they become incapacitated.

In any case, I notarized this Power of Attorney, and the client took it to his bank, and it was rejected. But, why? Nothing was wrong with the document or the notarization. So, what was it? The bank had THEIR OWN form of Power of Attorney. We learned the hard way. After spending hundreds on an Attorney and $50 on me, he now knew what to do. So, I had to meet the client at the bank. I forget which bank it was. One of the big ones. Perhaps Bank of America, Chase, or some other big name. They had a form on card stock that had a carbon copy. There was no room to put my stamp. It was idiotic. They wanted the stamp on the form itself and no Acknowledgment Certificates stapled on. So, I filled out the Acknowledgment wording and notarized the form. Voila — acceptable.

So, the lesson for today is — what the law says is acceptable is very different than what the document custodian (the person receiving and keeping or holding onto the document) might see as acceptable. Sending notarized documents to China, the stamp has to be on the document, but try explaining to them that the California Notary Verbiage needs to be on the document too if they want their stamp. Good luck. Warn your clients of the fact that their bank might not accept the Power of Attorney. The moral of the story is to ask the document custodian what type of power of attorney THEY want.

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The Power of Attorney was rejected 2017
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=18954

Index of posts about Power of Attorney
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20255

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August 27, 2012

Notarizing Documents for the Elderly

Filed under: California_Notary,Popular on Twitter 2012,Power of Attorney — Tags: , , , , , , , — admin @ 10:14 am

Notarizing for the elderly: Making a difference

Notarizing documents for the elderly can sometimes be a precarious task. At best, it can also be very rewarding, a chance to save senior citizens from poor medical or financial decisions. Some of our notaries have recently done a great service by scrupulously looking out for this fragile population and speaking out in order to protect them.

A California notary tells us, “I was going to a signing, and I really didn’t have any information about the borrower. The caregiver for the elderly man answered the door, and said ‘Are you aware that Mr. Jones has Alzheimer’s? He thinks you are here to give him $3000. He was cleaning the house all night to impress you.’ Apparently, someone had called him from an Internet company and had gotten him to do the loan. The care attendant said she would have to call the man’s son. I left the loan documents with the man, and immediately called the loan officer. I said, ‘This man’s son has a power of attorney. If I hear of this man signing these documents himself, I will turn you in.’ I never heard from them again,” sighs the California notary, who knows to this day she provided an unanticipated service for Mr. Jones.

Another California notary from Oakland tells a similar story: he came to notarize a refinance, but the woman who owned the home did not want to sign. It turned out that the ‘relative’ who was claiming to have a valid power of attorney was not even related to the homeowner…but had somehow persuaded the lender that she had a POA–and was planning to drain $20,000 from the home and then put the woman in a nursing home. The notary got a bad feeling about all this when he first called to confirm the signing. The old woman confided in the notary her unwillingness to sign, and the notary, on a hunch, called the authorities. They arrested the “relative”…and an actual relative was called upon to assist. Luckily, the equity in the home remained intact, and our notary was very pleased. “It was just lucky that I realized what was going on,” he says, “and made the call. Some people might say it wasn’t any of my business. A notary actually is taken quite seriously as a ‘reporter’ in cases like this. I was glad I did what I did,” says our California notary.

“One man thought he was getting back $400 more on his loan than he actually did. When we went over the paperwork, he actually started crying. I was able to explain things to him, but he chose to call the lender and delay the closing…although he did end up closing that week. The lender did something for him, made some deal with him that made him feel better. Many elderly people feel they are being taken advantage of, and many are in a position of weakness. I see a lot of happy, wealthy elderly, some who own several houses in several parts of the country. I also see a lot of poor people who are elderly and who never recovered from 2008,” says one Hawaii notary with relatives in California. “We are trying to do more to protect them.”

A Hawaii notary in Honolulu who does a lot of notary work with the elderly tells us, “Sometimes at a hospital signing I have to determine whether or not the person knows what he or she is signing. I ask the person’s name and I keep asking questions. If the person does not know what he or she is signing, I leave.” Our astute young Hawaii notary adds, “There are lots of times there is a doubt as to the competence of the person, and you really have to be very sure. Your have to protect their interests. That is why it is good that California, for instance, just passed a new law regarding notarizing a power of attorney.” [see blog June 3 2012 “A New California Notary Law”]

Tweets:
(1) Notarizing documents for the elderly can sometimes be a precarious task; at best very rewarding
(2) “Are you aware that Mr. Jones (the signer) has Alzeimers? He thinks ur here to give him $3000!”
(3) Many elderly signers feel they are being taken advantage of, and that they have a weakness.

You might also like:

Power of Attorney at a nursing home
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=2305

Dragging the person’s arm: A signing for an elderly woman
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=610

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February 10, 2012

Power of Attorney at a nursing home

Filed under: Hospital & Jail Signings,Posts With Many Comments,SEO,Ultra-Popular — Tags: , , , , — admin @ 9:58 am

Power of Attorney signing at a Nursing Home
 
This was a signing that was doomed from the beginning. I was a relatively new notary, and hadn’t been burned enough to have any sense.  I was like the cat who hadn’t learned to be wary of crossing the road. On the other hand, during my childhood, we had a cat who regularly sat right on the yellow line in the middle of the road.  Let’s just say that she had a good sense of timing.  My timing unfortunately wasn’t so good this time, and neither was my judgement.
 
A call from a convalescent home
It was a call from a lady in her late fifties.  She seemed like a very normal person.  She was taking care of an elderly lady who had nobody.  Of course, when I got the call, I didn’t have the sense to ask who was going to pay me or how they were going to pay me. This job was so bizarre, that even the most experienced notary has probably never seen anything like it.  So, I went to the nursing home and went in the door.  This place was horrible.  People were screaming and moaning all the time.  Plus the stench was horrible. The nurses didn’t want to open the windows because they didn’t want bacteria coming in.  My news for them is that there would be more bacteria going out than in if they opened the window. 
 
A walk down the hallway.
“Help me…. help me…. will you help me?”.  An old bedridden lady wanted to be turned over. I am not skilled at pampering the elderly, and the nurses were ignoring these helpless victems.  A crazy old man tried to make conversation with me walking down the hall.  This hallway should be called the hall of desperation. I got to the correct room number finally. If only I had brought an oxygen tank so I wouldn’t have had to breath in there. The lady in her 50’s wanted me to have the elderly lady sign a power of attorney document. Neither one of them had a clue how these documents worked. They needed my help filling it out and I told them that I don’t offer legal advice.  So, I had to wait while these crazy ladies took thirty minutes to do what they should have had prepared long before they called me. I neglected to ask them if their document was complete by the way.
 
The finished power of attorney
They kept asking me what to do. I kept saying, “you need to talk to an attorney”. I asked them why they had me come all the way down there when they were not ready to sign a completed document.  I had to teach them what a grantor and grantee was.  I told them that in this other place, they should write what the powers the grantor is assigning to the attorney in fact (grantee).  That helped get them through this daunting task.   Finally, the document was done.  The old lady could hardly sit up, let alone write anything.  She wrote some chicken scratch which was not even ledgable. I had to do a signature by X with two subscribing witnesses with her.   Finally, we were done.

 The payment
The attorney in fact got out a checkbook and proceeded to pay me.  I said, that the check didn’t belong to her, but to the old lady.  The lady in her 50’s said that she had been granted the power to do financial transactions for the older lady and would use the old lady’s check book to write me a check.  I didn’t like this idea. I said that I wanted to be paid in cash please. Neither ladies had a dime on them. So, I took the check, and needless to say it bounced. 
 
Insist on cash
If you do a jail or hospital signing, you will be dealing with very unreliable people a very high percentage of the time. Get your travel fee upon walking in the door before you even meet the signer.  If for any reason you can not complete the signing, you at least have some cash in your pocket.  Knowing how to do a signing by X is a valuable skill that experienced notary publics use if you work with the elderly.

You might also like:

12 questions to ask at hospital notarizations
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20519

Rules for notarizing a bedridden person

Do you like your job? A major headache of a hospital job.

Dragging the person’s arm

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November 14, 2011

Power of Attorney Signings

Filed under: Power of Attorney,SEO,Technical & Legal,Ultra-Popular — Tags: , , , , , , — admin @ 3:58 pm

Power of Attorney Notary Signings
 
It is common for notaries to get a job notarizing a signature of a grantor on a power of attorney document.  It is also common for a signer who is the attorney in fact to sign documents in their official capacity as an attorney in fact.  The problems is that most notaries haven’t a clue how to handle this type of common, yet critical situation. 
 
Types of powers of attorneys
First of all, as a notary public, you are not required to understand the contents of the document.  For an acknowledged signature, the signer should be named in the document and should sign it.  Other than that, you just need to be sure the signer understands the document, and you shouldn’t have any indication that the document is fraudulent (how would you know anyway?).  Their are banking powers of attorney, durable powers of attorney, health care powers of attorney, and living trusts which are a sort of power of attorney. There are other types too, but these are the most common ones.
 
What does a notary need to know about powers of attorney?
You need to know who a grantor and grantee is.  You need to know who an attorney in fact is (= the grantee).  You need to know how the attorney in fact signs a document.  You need to know that California notaries must take journal thumbprints when notarizing signatures on powers of attorney.
 
 
Is the form I am using acceptable?
Notaries may NOT recommend particular power of attorney forms, nor should they assist in filling them out.  The notary should look for blanks, and refuse to notarize if there are any blanks in the document.  It is not a crime for a notary to have blank standardized power of attorney forms in their briefcase, so long as they make it clear that they are not giving legal advice and not recommending the use of those forms.  You might tell the client that they should check with the document custodian (whomever they are submitting the documents to), to see what type of paperwork they will accept.  What is legal, and what is acceptable to the recipient are often two different things.
 
Banking power of attorney
Most banks have their own power of attorney form which is on card stock and leaves about half an inch to squeeze your two and a half inch wide notary seal (how educated of them!).  If asked to notarize a banking power of attorney, just do what the client asks within the limits of the law, but for your knowledge, you should be aware that the bank may not accept a power of attorney that they didn’t draft and that the client might be advised to check with the bank before doing any business with a notary public. 
 
How does an attorney in fact sign?
The person who has been granted special powers from a power of attorney is the grantee or attorney in fact.  They can sign in two ways that I am aware of.  If the grantor is John Doe, and the attorney in fact is Sally Smith, here is how Sally signs on behalf of John.
(1)  John Doe, by Sally Smith, his attorney in fact
(2) Sally Smith, as attorney in fact for John Doe
 
Power of attorney documents at a loan signing
Whether or not the loan will be accepted is hard to say.  However, many lenders will require a copy of the power of attorney to accompany the documents. 
 
Acknowledgment Forms
Some acknowledgment forms allow the notary to identify the capacity of the signer.  One of the standard check boxes on an acknowledgment certificate form is for attorney in fact, and other corporate offices are sometimes mentioned as well.

You might also like:

Index of posts about Power of Attorney
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20255

How do you get a Power of Attorney Document?
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20785

Notarizing Documents for the Elderly
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=3334

Notarized Affidavits Information
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=1963

Bank of America Power of Attorney Form
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=21327

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November 11, 2011

Notary Journal Thumbprints – they can save your neck!

Filed under: Technical & Legal — Tags: , , , , , , , , , , — admin @ 8:23 am

Notary Journal Thumbprints
 
How adamant are you about taking journal thumbprints?  As a California notary public, you are required to take notary journal thumbprints for deeds effecting real property and power of attorney documents.  Notary thumbprint taking is a serious business and can keep you out of court.
 
Taking precautions as a notary
I have written other blog posts about precautions that notaries can take.  Notaries can use an inkless embosser in addition to an inked seal.  They can emboss every page of every document they ever notarize as a precaution against page switching which is a common crime that takes place after multi-page documents have been notarized. Taking a precaution of taking journal thumbprints is smart also, and can keep you out of court.
 
Suspicion of identity fraud
Let’s say that you notarized a signature on a document and that someone involved in the transaction suspects identity fraud.  The first thing they will do is to track down the notary who notarized the signature on the document and start asking questions about the signer. You will not remember the signer well, unless you took notes in your journal about what they looked like, how they acted, how old they were, etc.  But, if you have a thumbprint, that is absolute proof of the signer’s identity.  No two thumbprints are identical, and you can’t fake a thumbprint (forge a thumbprint) in front of a notary.
 
The investigation ended once I produced a thumbprint
If someone questions you about a particular notarization, and you say you have a journal thumbprint, the investigation might just end right there.  It happened to me as a California notary public during my first four year term. I saved myself from a potentially long visit to court.  I got a phone call from someone investigating fraud.  Someone had cheated some elderly people whom I had notarized.  One of the documents used to allegedly cheat them had been notarized by myself in my capacity as a California notary public. Since I had a journal thumbprint, the identity of the signers was no longer in question.  The person said they had no further questions the minute I told them I had a thumbprint. They didn’t even want a copy of the journal entry with the thumbprint.
 
Weak thumbprints with the elderly
The flaw of thumbprints are that elderly people often lose the tread on their fingers.  I am talking about really old people, perhaps in their eighties or nineties.  There is nothing you can do in that case, but at least you have a print, no matter how featureless it is. Personally, with signers over eighty, I recommend a retinal scan, which is not possible for a notary to take in 2011, but maybe in 2015… we can always hope.
 
Regardless of your state of commission
Whether you are a Florida notary public, a California notary, or notary in another state, if you are notarizing signatures on a power of attorney or real estate deeds, get a journal thumbprint whether it is required by law or not. That thumbprint could save your neck.  It is not a bad idea to require signers to give thumbprints for all documents and even oaths or affirmations.  It keeps them honest.  The minute they start making excuses why they shouldn’t have to be thumbprinted, that is suspicious behavior, and you might want to refuse service to them.
 
Bring wipes!
Don’t forget to bring wet naps or wipes of some sort.  It is polite to have something for the signer to wipe their hands off with.  Even with the NNA’s inkless thumbprinter which is a product I always had several backups in stock of, you should offer a wipe.  I strongly recommend having at least one inkless thumbprinter in your notary carry all bag!

Please visit our notary search page to see our notary public California page and notary public Florida page!

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Thumbprinting in Texas
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=19672

Multiple title companies told Notaries NOT to thumbprint?
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=19461

Notary Public 101’s guide to Notary Journals
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=19511

Thumbprint taking step by step
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=1689

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January 15, 2011

Power of Attorney: Types Often Created

Filed under: Power of Attorney — Tags: — admin @ 12:45 am

POWER OF ATTORNEY: TYPES OFTEN CREATED

A General Power of Attorney is a broad type of POA document, and gives the Attorney in Fact the power to execute, on behalf of the grantor, both legal and financial agreements that are binding.

A Durable Power of Attorney is essentially a General Power of Attorney but, as the name suggests, is meant to be of a permanent nature because the grantor has agreed in writing that he or she wishes the Power of Attorney to remain in effect should the grantor become permanently ill or disabled. Many financial institutions prefer this type of POA, and all fifty states recognize some form of Durable Power of Attorney. SEE BELOW “What rights does the agent or Attorney in Fact have?”

A Specific Power of Attorney (also called Special Power of Attorney) will be in force for a limited amount of time, or will delegate power to the grantee or agent for only a specific instance, such as the signing of certain papers at a location the grantor or principal cannot travel to due to a physical ailment.

A Medical Power of Attorney grants the Attorney in Fact the right to make decisions about medical treatment or health care on behalf of the principal or grantor, perhaps during an illness or for a period of time following an accident.

A Springing Power of Attorney goes into effect at some date or circumstance in the future, for example when cancer spreads so as to disable the grantor, and the POA remains in effect until the grantor’s death.

A Power of Attorney for Care of a Minor Child is a document that temporarily assigns another person the right to make health care or legal decisions on behalf of a child who may be in their care. Many states limit the term of this Power of Attorney to six months, after which time guardianship must be sought if the parents cannot care for the child for any reason (disability or death).

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You might also like:

Index of posts about Power of Attorney
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20255

Index of posts about common types of notarized documents
http://blog.123notary.com/?p=20258

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January 8, 2011

Good ID is not Enough

Filed under: Ken Edelstein,Popular on Twitter 2011 — Tags: , , , — admin @ 10:38 am

It’s a sad notary who is writing this installment. I write this in the evening after the culmination of a series of events. My tale will be familiar to many, especially those with years of experience. It started out as a routine request to notarize a Power of Attorney, then the Agent would sign two additional forms using their Powerof Attorney authority. The assignment was from a lost funds recovery agency. The three short documents were emailed to me; and my fee was coming as a check; mailed the same day.

Delays developed into two weeks, presumably, I did not verify; the check cleared long prior to the start of the assignment. As to the assignment: An elderly lady was in a convalescent home, she was to give her son Power of Attorney to dispose of some assets. Immediately my antenna went up. Hospital environments are challenging, seeing proper ID often a major problem. He also assured me that she was rational and able to understand the document she was to sign. The son related that she did not have “Govt issued Photo ID” but a collection of documents that should suffice. We discussed this issue at length. I have wide latitude in what constitutes proper ID in NY State. The rule here is that the notary is required to view “adequate proof”. That’s it. No further guidelines.

The son could produce several original (not photocopies) documents that only a family member would have access to. The sticking point was the aspect of photo ID. Finally, a breakthrough; the facility had in the patient folder an admission picture, and were willing to give me a copy (to be returned with other photocopies of original documents. It was not the best ID situation, but the lady had been in the home for over a decade, and the assets were recently discovered.

I know, I’m letting the son’s “story” influence my “is it good enough” decision. There were other positive aspects of her identification that I will not disclose. Suffice to say, I informed the son that strict adherence to gathering her ID was essential. Looking at the notary section of her Power of Attorney, I noticed that “produced a driver license as identification” was preprinted. I could not edit the file as the PDF was from a scan. I had the attorney send me an editable file and changed that line to mention by name each of the ID components that I planned to accept. A quick scan and I proceeded to send the scan to the attorney for approval. Approval granted.

The next hurdle was witnesses. I could be one of them. The son said he would “draft” a nurse to be the second witness. Been there, suffered that. Many is the facility that I have visited that do not allow staff to sign anything. The son insisted they would. I asked for the name and contact number of the specific staff member to be sure to arrive during their shift. Son was unable to obtain any commitment and a few days delay was incurred as he found a witness.

Finally, after two weeks, we set a date and time. I prepared two of each of the three documents in case there was a mistake. Upon entering her room my heart sank. It was obvious that she would be unable to understand what she was to sign. Additionally, she was physically unable to sign. The floor nurse was called, and confirmed my opinion. She could hear, but not respond to “blink three times if your son is standing in front of you”. The floor nurse called the Social Worker who asked “what’s going on in here”. A brief explanation later yielded “I will not permit her to sign anything”. Of course that was redundant; I would not notarize with or without her permission. The son lamented that the “Court Appointed Guardian” procedure was too time-consuming and expensive. This was my cue to leave, feeling sad for her affliction. But, the law is inflexible, applies to all; and as NY notaries are sworn officers of the State Department – I could only walk away.

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Notary Etiquette from Athiest to Zombie
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January 7, 2011

Rich man poor man: Market Yourself to the Wealthy

Filed under: Ken Edelstein,Popular Overall — Tags: , , , , — admin @ 10:24 pm

Rich Man Poor Man

Here is some shocking news – wealthy people have an easier time paying a higher notary fee compared to poor people. Wow! Whatta surprise. Pardon my obvious statement. But I do wonder why so many notaries are struggling with signing service fees – fees paid by little entities with balance sheets that are awash in red ink. Do you have a signing service in your town? Probably not, but you do have many wealthy people whose time is very valuable. Now you know the secret of collecting those higher and much easier to earn fees. Market yourself to the wealthy. It’s that simple. It’s the opposite of going, as a notary to the poorhouse seeking clients. Who are the wealthy? You already know – but might not know just why they need you. Let’s take some time out from the signing rat race, step out of the maze and let me show you the shortcut to the cheese.

I had a fellow who gave me over 17 Apostille assignments for an adoption. He needed various doctor statements to be notarized and receive an Apostille. My fee for each, no discounting; was on the high side for an edoc job. However, the work was much quicker and cleaner. He was a –big shot – stockbroker. He worried about missing an important call and losing a commission that would have been over 6 months of earning – for me. But, not for him; he makes that much money in the course of a 15 minute phone call. I know this for a fact as he told me – while paying me – how he just made several thousand dollars. He even gave me a Franklyn for a tip!

Attorneys often receive Power of Attorney; to sign papers for their clients. The high profile client does not want to hunt for a notary. The Attorney of record, as involved in the transaction cannot notarize the client giving him the power – so an outside notary is needed. Enter the mobile notary, me, to their office. Of course they have others who usually handle this, but sometimes they are on vacation or out sick – I get the call. Doctors, will not go hunting for a notary – they like to have a card on file of a reliable notary who will go to them.

Everyday shopkeepers, who must –mind the store- often have legal documents that must be notarized. The needs vary greatly – the common thread is that their time is worth more than your time. They can pay me XX which is very much worth my while to go to them – and that XX is less than the revenue they would lose by going to find a notary. Clearly, this works best with people whose time is one of their most valuable assets. As a http://newyorkmobilenotarypublic.com I probably have more rich people here in Manhattan compared to most places. But the concept is applicable in your home town too. Give a card to the general manager of the large Big Box stores in the local shopping centers. I sure don’t have many WalMarts in Manhattan. That person is busy, very busy – and is likely to need a notary now and then but do they have your card? That person pays to save time using company money – it’s not out of the managers’ pocket – does that matter to you.

To harp on the point. Seek out the wealthy who have little time to spare and more money to spend. When you run out of wealthy prospects seek out those who can pay using –company money- to save their personal time. Trust me on this – it is very pleasant to work with these people. They are very appreciative of your services, and are willing to pay fair rates. Now compare what I have written above to a discussion with El Cheepo signing as you beg for an additional ten dollars for faxing 50 pages. Are you marketing yourself wisely to the right prospects?

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7 ways to use Facebook to market your notary services
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